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Mars
Grandstanding Collector
Posts: 5356Joined: May 03, 2003 Last Visit: May 18, 2013 Location: Waterloo, Ontario, Canada
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 Posted: Tue Feb 02, 2010 10:57 pm |
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JasonZavoda
Sage Collector
JG Valuation Board
Posts: 2786Joined: Jul 12, 2007 Last Visit: May 18, 2013
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Posted: Tue Feb 02, 2010 11:06 pm |
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And he just sold a few rare T&T modules (forgot their names but one had the big swastika on the cover).
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Mars
Grandstanding Collector
Posts: 5356Joined: May 03, 2003 Last Visit: May 18, 2013 Location: Waterloo, Ontario, Canada
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Posted: Tue Feb 02, 2010 11:16 pm |
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JasonZavoda wrote:And he just sold a few rare T&T modules (forgot their names but one had the big swastika on the cover).
That's what I was wondering - if those items were "reprints" possibly unauthorized as well.
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Pipswich
Prolific Collector
Posts: 698Joined: Nov 05, 2008 Last Visit: May 19, 2013
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Posted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 1:13 am |
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He is copying all the stuff, I is my guess. I got several original rare items and I think all or all but one also came with the newer printed copies as bonus items. This was when I bought some items in December. Dunno if that's what happened with the this item, but that is my guess. Frankly, I expected him to be copying all the rare stuff from Ken and selling them in the future based on what I read here about his rep. I do hope the buyer here got the actual original in addition to a copy for the $1300+ he paid. Like I said, my guess is that he did.
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Mars
Grandstanding Collector
Posts: 5356Joined: May 03, 2003 Last Visit: May 18, 2013 Location: Waterloo, Ontario, Canada
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Posted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 1:19 am |
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From the post, I don't think he did get the original (just the reproduction) and from the sounds of his later reply, it sounds like the seller is looking to keep the $1300.
The seller did make copies of all the stuff I am sure. He was selling reproductions of most of them. I believe the price he was asking for a repo of 1st print T&T was $40.
A number of the items that he was selling were unauthorized copies - where the author didn't know anything about him reproducing them.
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Pipswich
Prolific Collector
Posts: 698Joined: Nov 05, 2008 Last Visit: May 19, 2013
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Posted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 1:27 am |
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I just went back and looked. The Computer Generated Dungeon and The Elemental Dungeon came with both originals and copies. The Knights of the Broken Cross did not come with a copy and I don't recall if The Monkey God's Curse came with a copy and am not sure where I filed it to check.
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Kingofpain89
Long-Winded Collector
Posts: 4690Joined: Oct 31, 2004 Last Visit: May 20, 2013 Location: Plano, Texas
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Posted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 8:24 am |
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Mars wrote:From the post, I don't think he did get the original (just the reproduction) and from the sounds of his later reply, it sounds like the seller is looking to keep the $1300.
Man that sucks. I've given Kynan a bit of grief over the past couple of years but no one deserves to be ripped off like that. 
You don't like your job, you don't strike. You go in every day and do it really half-assed. That's the American way. - Homer Simpson
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Deadlord
Grandstanding Collector
Posts: 5204Joined: Jun 30, 2003 Last Visit: May 18, 2013 Location: New Hampsha
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Posted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 8:36 am |
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That's more than enough money to hop a plane to address the issue.
If you hit a Rowsdower, you get to keep it.
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Gnat the Beggar
Long-Winded Collector
JG Valuation Board
Acaeum Donor
Posts: 4780Joined: Oct 11, 2004 Last Visit: May 20, 2013 Location: Texas
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Posted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 8:41 am |
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I was a bidder on some of his latest group of items sold (by Shipman/selling4u) on E-Bay too, inlcuding the Nazi themed Knights of the Broken Cross Module and some of the other items that pip won.
I did win a few listings though (musta been items that pip did not bid on) and all of the items combined cost me only about $100 or so ....
Got them all and they are all originals (I have no doubts).
Plus he sent me some other tidbits for free.
However, it looks to me that TFM was ripped off here and for a HUGE sum of money too.
A blog page regarding Shipman and his many years of Copyright Violations.
http://mxyzplk.wordpress.com/2009/12/11/outlaw-press-aka-jim-shipman-is-a-big-crook/
Ken St. Andre (An original publisher of T&T) posted a comment himself to that blog page a month ago (Dec 11, 2009).
atroll // December 11, 2009 at 11:40 pm | Reply Shipman claims to have paid a British artbroker over $4000 for the “stolen” artwork. The broker may have appropriated all the art. However, he has been told to not use any stolen artwork on any Tunnels and Trolls products and to stop publishing them immediately. I probably should delete that old blog about Gristlegrim. A closer examination of what he sent me as a finished product proved to be so faulty that I grew angry with him, told him not to sell it, and members of Trollhalla not to buy it. Some of the Outlaw Press products are legitimate, however. My novel, Griffin Feathers, features a fine painted front cover by Simon Tranter that I personally paid for. Needless to say we are all very unhappy with Mr. Shipman right now. My followers at Trollhalla have been asked not to send him any more T & T material. I think Outlaw Press will be coming to an end soon. Wait and see. –Ken St. Andre
"Guys, I am starting to think Tegel Manor might be haunted..."
Stated by me as a PC during a run of Tegel Manor DMed by killjoy at NTRPGCon 2010
Charter Member of the ATM
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Badmike
Grandstanding Collector
Acaeum Donor
Posts: 7198Joined: Jun 23, 2003 Last Visit: May 21, 2013 Location: DFW TX
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Posted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 9:42 am |
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RaisedFromTheDead wrote:That's more than enough money to hop a plane to address the issue.
Yeh, I agree, $1300 crosses the "ass kicking" line for me too.
Mike B.
"THE MORE YOU THINK ABOUT WHY i DONE WHAT i DONE THE MORE i LAUGH" Cougar
"The Acaeum hates fun" Sir Allen
"I had a collecting emergency" Nogrod
Co-founder of the North Texas RPG Con
http://www.ntrpgcon.com
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ashmire13
Long-Winded Collector
Posts: 3123Joined: Oct 10, 2006 Last Visit: Apr 17, 2013 Location: Wandering aimlessly on the 8th level down...
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Posted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 11:20 am |
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Hell, for that sort of money, I'd take a walk to his front door and have a 'chat'... 
Rolls a '3'
"Did I hit.....?"
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Mars
Grandstanding Collector
Posts: 5356Joined: May 03, 2003 Last Visit: May 18, 2013 Location: Waterloo, Ontario, Canada
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Posted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 1:30 pm |
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I'll add that at one point I bought a couple items supposedly by "Dragon Tree Press". When I got them they were not from any Dragon Tree Press that I was aware of. When I asked about them, he said they were printed up by a guy he knew from the 70s that used the name. They were however, new printings done in the late 2000s.
Other stuff that he published and sold (without the author's knowledge) include adventures from old fanzines - probably where the stolen art comes from to make covers for these and then reprints of other T&T related items such as Dimensions & Doors by Bob Liddil. His excuse for the latter was that he thought Bob was dead - I don't know what arrangement Bob made with him after the fact.
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Deadlord
Grandstanding Collector
Posts: 5204Joined: Jun 30, 2003 Last Visit: May 18, 2013 Location: New Hampsha
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Posted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 2:15 pm |
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How is it this guy hasn't been shut down or killed?
If you hit a Rowsdower, you get to keep it.
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JasonZavoda
Sage Collector
JG Valuation Board
Posts: 2786Joined: Jul 12, 2007 Last Visit: May 18, 2013
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Posted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 3:28 pm |
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RaisedFromTheDead wrote:How is it this guy hasn't been shut down or killed?
There is a thread that just recently revealed what a scumbag he is. Its an amazing read. The first guy from South America posts that he is stealing artwork, and for about 5 pages people blast him for accusing the outlaw press scumbag, then one artist after another finds stolen artwork the guy is using for cover art, then the tide turns and there are dozens of artists finding stolen artwork.
So it happened within the last few months, then it takes someone to afford a lawyer and take this guy to court, and even then longer to get to trial, if that ever happens.
The problem is that this is small potatoes, even as much as this guy has done, and it is expensive, so more than likely nothing will come of it except public censure, which doesn't mean anything if people keep buying from him.
He is a scumbag... every dime you give him is just a slap in the face to the gaming community.
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lokiwookie
Sage Collector
Posts: 2142Joined: Feb 07, 2006 Last Visit: May 20, 2013 Location: France / Cité des Papes
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Posted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 4:41 pm |
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Happy to didn't win anything from him 
so bad story for Kynan. I hope he will do anything to get his money back and to throw this crook into jail.
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deimos3428
Long-Winded Collector
Acaeum Donor
Posts: 3058Joined: Jul 09, 2004 Last Visit: May 10, 2013
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Posted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 4:54 pm |
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Pipswich
Prolific Collector
Posts: 698Joined: Nov 05, 2008 Last Visit: May 19, 2013
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Posted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 6:52 pm |
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I am very glad I underestimated the price it would take to snipe that item now. I hope Kynan gets this resolved quickly.
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JohnGaunt
Sage Collector
Posts: 2332Joined: Feb 20, 2006 Last Visit: Mar 24, 2013 Location: Shipwrecked by the laughter of the gods
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Posted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 8:16 pm |
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I recently bought paperbacks from him. He included some extra items, one of which was a color photocopy or laserprint of a Lost Worlds book cover. I didn't think anything at the time beyond "Well, that's odd . . ."
Who was it that warned against dealing with crooks? Truer words were never written.
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FormCritic
Grandstanding Collector
Acaeum Donor
Posts: 6709Joined: Jul 16, 2005 Last Visit: May 15, 2013
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Posted: Thu Feb 04, 2010 2:06 am |
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I immediately grabbed the zoom feature, expecting to land on the roof of outlaw-press.com.
I landed instead on an interesting satellite photo of a forest.
"But I have watched the dragons come, fire-eyed, across the world."
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benjoshua
Sage Collector
Acaeum Donor
Posts: 2084Joined: May 30, 2007 Last Visit: May 20, 2013 Location: USA Georgia
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Posted: Thu Feb 04, 2010 6:48 am |
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FormCritic wrote:
I immediately grabbed the zoom feature, expecting to land on the roof of outlaw-press.com.
I landed instead on an interesting satellite photo of a forest.
You must have looked after the fawn's & satyr's wild romp and orgy was over.
Truth is worth finding and life is too short to work for money.
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