mbassoc2003 wrote in Your opinion doesnt matter anymore:Its not 'scoffing'.

Its a question.

Is the idea that you buy a product that has already been put beyond reach of you? And you pay a premium knowing that if you want to check out what you've bought that you have to take a financial hit? Is the not the point of the plastic box?

Its the shrink wrap thing with greater deterrent against inspection. Yes, if you ship them the product for grading you know what the quality of the product you have shipped is. If they grade it higher than it should be you get a payoff and you are incentivized not to disclose their error. If they grade it lower than it should be you have to fight with their customer services people, and the internet is full of tales of things the company claim 'they missed'.

But if you are buying blind from someone else, you have no rights whatsoever, and you are incentivized never to look and find out if you have been told the truth. Because to look at something or question CGC's choices results in you destroying the product you bought.

And are these graded by professionals? No. They are just guys like you and me. Yes, some of them have been looking at comic books for 20 years, and some people like myself have been looking at RPG collectables for 20 years.

I would trust your opinion as a board member here who we've all know for many years (to one degree or other) over the opinion of some guys in a factory unit in Florida.

What's more, if you sold me something I would be able to inspect it. And if I disagreed with your described condition, I would trust we could work something out with more diplomacy and speed than CGC's Customer Services team would be willing to help someone who believed they had been sold a misgraded product.

I’ve never used CGC (and I most likely never will).  I’m curious though - if you send them something to grade, do they report back to you their grade and reasoning prior to sealing it in their plastic case?

[quote="Skullhammer";p=351995][/quote]

Nope, you get the return package voila! You can pay a smaller fee ahead of time, and they wont slab lower graded ones, based on your request though.

Badmike wrote in Your opinion doesnt matter anymore:SW items? They are grading on condition only and the quality of product they can see from the outside....just as anyone does. No problem with those.

I used to deal with CGC extensively with comics. Unless something has changed recently they don't grade shrinkwrap/polybagged items. You can submit them in shrink but they will open them for grading and encapsulation. Again, I was just dealing with comics, but I doubt very much they'd have a different policy just for RPG items.

Also, if there are loose components (say, for example, the magic viewer from MV1) they do not include those in the encapsulation. Take a look a the comic image I snagged off eBay. No idea what they'd do with a fold-out map, but I'm inclined to say they wouldn't slab those either since they aren't part of the book.

Another thing to keep in mind is that restoration (which includes amateur color touch up, tape, etc.) and missing parts/loose pages will get you something other than a blue label. Purple (restoration) and green (qualified) labels are, for the most part, considered A Very Bad Thing and dramatically affect value.

So you send them a 1st print First Fantasy Campaign, of a Tegel. They get a guy who's never played D&D before to go on the internet and compare the contents of what sits in front of him with photos from other sellers on eBay to see if he can work out if everything is there or not? And he tries to guess which printing he has based on his own gut instinct feeling about how old it is, and what other sellers think theirs are, and maybe he compares his copy with stiff NKG are selling, because they are the experts. Or does he just take the word of the guy who sent it to him?

Yep. That seems legit.

Sorry I'm late, this is insanely exciting news imo. I've said some on this in past posts, no interest in using the service myself but if I did ---

If you go by past introductions of the same thing for comics, coins & cards, getting in early can save you some fees, if you end up doing a lot.

Remembering back, it seemed like stamps, coins & cards had the best potential market immediately. Comics took forever, because, and I really remember hearing a ton of long-time collectors talking about this - comics had inside pages, and centerfolds, inserts, posters, etc AND some are writer/editor signed or have artist doodles (or someone else's doodles) AND different collectors see the differences differently.  

I'm selling some comics right now ungraded. There are probably a few I could slab and get more on eBay but I have a crap internet connection and thankfully have a buyer that doesn't require pro grading, and quite honestly, is being pretty generous, if I know prices as well as I think I do. (I've know him for decades). Cool fact too about him (I hadn't talked to him in years), he's had weekly game go for almost 40 years now! His son has written a real game guide, one that's on paper AND costs money! I was so amazed by it. I haven't read much gaming lately, and nothing newer for a long time.

...daydreaming...

I do have some comic books that, if I wanted to sell them, it'd be dumb not to grade them. A bunch of US stamps too, some minor keys in possibly top or near top grade.

That said, I sold a comic some years ago at a local auction house with worldwide bidders. A place million dollar paintings are sold there sometimes and big time history, etc.
I didn't want to sell on eBay, and grading was a problem. 20 year old book. Everyone wanted to buy it or sell it graded that regularly dealt in comic books, and I thought it'd do better ungraded. Since it was mine, guess who got their way? It sold fine I thought, all that matters.
Didn't have to feel bad if it pulled a higher grade than it should have, and someone potentially feel gypped later on if they cracked the case open. I really wanted them to know what they were buying, and that particular auction house let me do the pictures and the condition report so I'd know it was auctioned fairly.
Whatever the buyer does is on them. Sorry, I meant to be short, but it was a neat sale. Only time my mother has seen the adult me applauded by a room full of people. No idea it'd happen, so I can't say CGC would have prevented that from happening but...

Anyway, big collectors of the "completely unloved in it's day" modules, etc probably will see big price gains on high grade, well stored collections in the next 8-10 years, to throw out a guess. After CGC gets their fees first!

In a few years the market will be as easy to read as anything else getting graded, it should be apparent what helps or doesn't. People forget how much CGC messed up in it's first two-three years of comics. It was so hated, then the big prices steadily came in and people couldn't ignore it anymore that liked money.

Tszii wrote in Your opinion doesnt matter anymore:That notch, cut into overstocked modules, is going to have an impact now. I never cared before, and kinda still dont, but I have seen some modules in great condition, save for a notch.

Is this something you would consider a large deduct for grading?

It's a serious hit in CDs, Records, Comic Books and books. Remaindered comic books have a lot more missing but in overstreet grading Very Good (4.0) was classified (circa 2014):

Cover shows moderate to significant wear, and may be loose but not completely detached. Moderate to extreme reduction in reflectivity. Can have an accumulation of creases or dimples. Corners may be blunted or abraded. Store stamps, name stamps, arrival dates, initials, etc. have no effect on this grade. Some discoloration, fading, foxing, and even minor soiling is allowed. As much as a 1/4" triangle can be missing out of the corner or edge; a missing 1/8" square is also acceptable. Only minor unobtrusive tape and other amateur repair allowed on otherwise high grade copies. Moderate spine roll may be present and/or a 1" spine split. Staples may be discolored. Minor to moderate staple tears and stress lines may be present, as well as some rust migration. Paper is (no worse than) brown but not brittle. A minor acidic odor can be detectable. Minor to moderate tears may be present. Centerfold may be loose or detached at one staple.

Good (2.0) excerpt The largest piece allowed missing from the front or back cover is usually a 1/2" triangle or a 1/4" square, although some Silver Age books such as 1960s Marvels have had the price corner box clipped from the top left front cover and may be considered Good if they would otherwise have graded higher.

Fair/Good (1.5) excerpt Up to 1/10 of the back cover may be missing.

Fair (1.0) excerpt Books in this condition generally have all pages and most of the covers, although there may be up to 1/4 of the front cover missing or no back cover, but not both.

It's just a guess but i'd assume CGC is going more like this than not. With missing anything being regarded as Poor.

At the same time, go look up coverless key comic books or "cover-only" listings and see all kinds of bidding and big numbers. Grading doesn't change what collectors regard AS desirable. It's still up to you on what you'll pay, and plenty of ungraded books are still sold.

Oh yeah  

Interesting.  So, they are just grading the exterior, which would pretty much be the case for anything in SW.

Sir Kill Alot wrote in Your opinion doesnt matter anymore:

I really need to do my homework with this stuff... Especially if its adoption really starts to take hold in our collectable space.

-SKA

AFA has graded a lot of those $5000 plus early Star Wars figures. Just like PSA, their two lower, cheaper, grading options are currently closed. Good news is, it only takes around three weeks to get a item back.


** expired/removed eBay auction **


I dont know what it would take for me to ship off a SW box set though. A raw module? Sure.